REMINDER: Siteowner has no obligation to monitor the Forums. However, Siteowner reserves the right to review the Materials submitted to or posted on the Forums, and remove, delete, redact or otherwise modify such Materials, in its sole discretion and for any reason whatsoever, at any time and from time to time, without notice or further obligation to you. Siteowner has no obligation to display or post any Materials provided by you. Siteowner reserves the right to disclose, at any time and from time to time, any information or Materials that Siteowner deems necessary or appropriate to satisfy any applicable law, regulation, contract obligation, legal or dispute process or government request. To further read the rules and terms of agreement of this Forum, click here.
Infrastructure expansion is only for baby boomers. The rest of us have the privilege of paying their social security and using a 100 year old electricity grid. We need more prisons and less schools to keep the boomers safe from weed criminals and rambunctious youths. Also, public transportation is bad because it harms the private sector.
We should all agree that in 50 years we will look like present day Haiti. Our sooty, brown sky looming over ancient freeways clogged with '90s Hondas and Toyotas next to clapboard houses not subject to any building codes, the way God intended. All the while citizens of Japan and Europe and China and India cruise over us in their hover cars, jeering and laughing.
"Look!" one will say, "their milk supply is nothing but growth hormones and non dairy creamer!" "Yes, and their cars cannot hover, because there are 'Liberals' who are stupid!" "Ha! You are right! America's misfortunes are the fault of one half of their two party system!" "Two parties is the best amount of parties to have since all issues have just two sides!" "Yes, everyone in the 1st world knows this!"
We'll still have a bigger army though.
Let's put Ogdenville on the map, California!
Post Extras:
CharmingSophisticate
Tom Curren status
Reged: 03/07/09
Posts: 11954
Loc: In Gods Country
Infrastructure expansion is only for baby boomers. The rest of us have the privilege of paying their social security and using a 100 year old electricity grid. We need more prisons and less schools to keep the boomers safe from weed criminals and rambunctious youths. Also, public transportation is bad because it harms the private sector.
We should all agree that in 50 years we will look like present day Haiti. Our sooty, brown sky looming over ancient freeways clogged with '90s Hondas and Toyotas next to clapboard houses not subject to any building codes, the way God intended. All the while citizens of Japan and Europe and China and India cruise over us in their hover cars, jeering and laughing.
"Look!" one will say, "their milk supply is nothing but growth hormones and non dairy creamer!" "Yes, and their cars cannot hover, because there are 'Liberals' who are stupid!" "Ha! You are right! America's misfortunes are the fault of one half of their two party system!" "Two parties is the best amount of parties to have since all issues have just two sides!" "Yes, everyone in the 1st world knows this!"
We'll still have a bigger army though.
Let's put Ogdenville on the map, California!
Could someone translate this for me please? There has to something in there that's worth reading.
Thank You Rich Cheney Jr Halliburton Action Sports LLC
-------------------- "...now tell me that wasn't fun!"
Capt. Jack Aubrey
Post Extras:
FecalFace
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 11/21/08
Posts: 6699
Loc: down there by the harbor
Infrastructure expansion is only for baby boomers. The rest of us have the privilege of paying their social security and using a 100 year old electricity grid. We need more prisons and less schools to keep the boomers safe from weed criminals and rambunctious youths. Also, public transportation is bad because it harms the private sector.
We should all agree that in 50 years we will look like present day Haiti. Our sooty, brown sky looming over ancient freeways clogged with '90s Hondas and Toyotas next to clapboard houses not subject to any building codes, the way God intended. All the while citizens of Japan and Europe and China and India cruise over us in their hover cars, jeering and laughing.
"Look!" one will say, "their milk supply is nothing but growth hormones and non dairy creamer!" "Yes, and their cars cannot hover, because there are 'Liberals' who are stupid!" "Ha! You are right! America's misfortunes are the fault of one half of their two party system!" "Two parties is the best amount of parties to have since all issues have just two sides!" "Yes, everyone in the 1st world knows this!"
We'll still have a bigger army though.
Let's put Ogdenville on the map, California!
-------------------- I suggest putting a teacher in every gun store.
Post Extras:
Norm'
Duke status
Reged: 01/31/03
Posts: 18698
Loc: Lovetron
This type of investment is prudent in this recessonary economic climate. Creating much needed jobs, improving infrastructure, facilitating commerce and tourism. Try to think of one bold investment from the last century in California which you would consider a waste of money. Adjusted for inflation, these types of investments pay off big time over 50-75 years. Whole new economies will likely emerge with the facilitation of the movement of people. Check out the bullet train between Amsterdam-Paris or Paris-London. Its responsible for enormous trade between these three metropolises.
Post Extras:
CharmingSophisticate
Tom Curren status
Reged: 03/07/09
Posts: 11954
Loc: In Gods Country
Quote: How will a bullet train from LAX to SAC facilitate commerce?
Where do you think the $68 billion or whatever this thing is going to cost is gonna go? Jerry Brown's pockets?
How about the contractors who win the bid? Who knows maybe Halliburton will be one of them.
How about the thousands that will be employed in this construction? They'll be spending their hard earned money? Yeah I know they'll be pesky union workers. Shucks.
How about the manufacturers that produce the parts and materials that go into this? Those that supply the rebar and cement for structures along the way.
How about the quarries that'll supply the gravel for the bedding of the tracks over hundreds of miles?
How about the electric company that provides the power to these trains?
How about the trucking companies that are hired to bring in all these materials?
How about the fuel companies that will provide the fuel for the heavy equipment used to build this line?
How about the staff that's employed to run this thing once it's up and running?
How about the companies that are doing concessions on these trains and in the stations?
How about the companies that will be profiting off of parking at stations?
How about the guy who opens up a hot dog stand right next to the new station?
I can keep going. Surely we can't count on every penny staying in state or even in country but the majority will. This thing is going to go on for a long time and a lot of money will be spent. But it's not going to just disappear. Yes this thing should ultimately be cost effective but keep in mind it's here to service us not profit off us. There's a lot of things in this world that simply aren't cost effective enough for private investors to tackle. Things where the potential for payback is too far down the line for the liking of most investors. Think about the interstate system. If we didn't have one would you think it'd be a good investment for a private corporation to build one? A project that takes ten plus years, costs billions and brings in nothing? No investor in their right mind would put their money into that. Which is why we have this little thing called government.
-------------------- "[Rush] doesn't influence me either - merely reinforces what I already know" - 23rdstMB
Post Extras:
23rdstMB
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 11/14/02
Posts: 6977
Loc: S-41.32 W174 44.83 - East Pe...
Quote: How will a bullet train from LAX to SAC facilitate commerce?
Where do you think the $68 billion or whatever this thing is going to cost is gonna go? Jerry Brown's pockets?
How about the contractors who win the bid? Who knows maybe Halliburton will be one of them.
How about the thousands that will be employed in this construction? They'll be spending their hard earned money? Yeah I know they'll be pesky union workers. Shucks.
How about the manufacturers that produce the parts and materials that go into this? Those that supply the rebar and cement for structures along the way.
How about the quarries that'll supply the gravel for the bedding of the tracks over hundreds of miles?
How about the electric company that provides the power to these trains?
How about the trucking companies that are hired to bring in all these materials?
How about the fuel companies that will provide the fuel for the heavy equipment used to build this line?
How about the staff that's employed to run this thing once it's up and running?
How about the companies that are doing concessions on these trains and in the stations?
How about the companies that will be profiting off of parking at stations?
How about the guy who opens up a hot dog stand right next to the new station?
I can keep going. Surely we can't count on every penny staying in state or even in country but the majority will. This thing is going to go on for a long time and a lot of money will be spent. But it's not going to just disappear. Yes this thing should ultimately be cost effective but keep in mind it's here to service us not profit off us. There's a lot of things in this world that simply aren't cost effective enough for private investors to tackle. Things where the potential for payback is too far down the line for the liking of most investors. Think about the interstate system. If we didn't have one would you think it'd be a good investment for a private corporation to build one? A project that takes ten plus years, costs billions and brings in nothing? No investor in their right mind would put their money into that. Which is why we have this little thing called government.
He's right, they built one to St. Lewis, MO with Chineese labor and horses. This one should be a piece of cake.
Post Extras:
GDaddy
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 01/16/06
Posts: 7135
Loc: Carlsbad
Quote: How will a bullet train from LAX to SAC facilitate commerce?
Where do you think the $68 billion or whatever this thing is going to cost is gonna go? Jerry Brown's pockets?
How about the contractors who win the bid? Who knows maybe Halliburton will be one of them.
How about the thousands that will be employed in this construction? They'll be spending their hard earned money? Yeah I know they'll be pesky union workers. Shucks.
How about the manufacturers that produce the parts and materials that go into this? Those that supply the rebar and cement for structures along the way.
How about the quarries that'll supply the gravel for the bedding of the tracks over hundreds of miles?
How about the electric company that provides the power to these trains?
How about the trucking companies that are hired to bring in all these materials?
How about the fuel companies that will provide the fuel for the heavy equipment used to build this line?
How about the staff that's employed to run this thing once it's up and running?
How about the companies that are doing concessions on these trains and in the stations?
How about the companies that will be profiting off of parking at stations?
How about the guy who opens up a hot dog stand right next to the new station?
I can keep going. Surely we can't count on every penny staying in state or even in country but the majority will. This thing is going to go on for a long time and a lot of money will be spent. But it's not going to just disappear. Yes this thing should ultimately be cost effective but keep in mind it's here to service us not profit off us. There's a lot of things in this world that simply aren't cost effective enough for private investors to tackle. Things where the potential for payback is too far down the line for the liking of most investors. Think about the interstate system. If we didn't have one would you think it'd be a good investment for a private corporation to build one? A project that takes ten plus years, costs billions and brings in nothing? No investor in their right mind would put their money into that. Which is why we have this little thing called government.
It entirely obvious how the money will spent. Also obvious is where it's coming from. What may not be so obvious is what other economic activities will not be supported as a result of this diversion. This is not "new money" that is just appearing out of thin air - it is being scavenged from other spending - public or private - that has already been occurring. There's a loss in there somewhere that this project must overcome in order to be economically feasible.
That's why the original question stands - what net benefits (aka surplus productivity) will the system provide beyond the diversion of funds being spent for its construction?
As for invoking the "serving mankind" argument that is a purely emotional line of reasoning that gets used when the numbers are indefensible. Really, no different than your favorite president's claim the regime change in Iraq is to give Iraqis freedom.
Post Extras:
ratfink
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 07/15/08
Posts: 6441
Loc: Texas Gulf de Mexico
Quote: russian trains are plentiful and always packed. the subway system in moscow and st. petersburg makes new york's look like a slow moving sh!thole...well, not hard to do. but it's been in their culture for a long time. most people just don't have cars.
here tho...meh.. people love their cars. austin finally finished their train, after i guess about 10 years. it's only like three cars and they recently put mirror tint on the windows so people can't see how empty it is.
a shame...i'd use it, but i don't live in the 'burbs.
i'd love a train to the coast though. i'd be the worst nightmare...a weekend train warrior!
Weekend warrior! here we come! you and me Urch, I'll spot us the rental when we get to LaLa.
F*ck Russia...if the USA made schit cars like these, we'd all be on the rail too
Surfers endorsing cattlecars, sheeesh.
Post Extras:
ifallalot
Duke status
Reged: 12/17/08
Posts: 17983
Loc: Carlsbad, CA
Are the people in my generation going to continue to harbor unfounded ill-will towards Middle Eastern countries like how Boomers feel about Russia and The Greatest Generation feels about Germany and Japan?
Indoctrination is a bitch
-------------------- The only two things in life that make it worth livin is guitars tuned good and firm feelin women
I don't give a sht about Middle Eastern countries one way or another, I am talking about the people #InOtherStates that are scared of Ahmed coming to Bumfuck, USA and #HatingTheirFreedom
I don't get what you're talking about still, although I do feel that the Flyover States pose a bigger threat to my desired way of life than anyone overseas
-------------------- The only two things in life that make it worth livin is guitars tuned good and firm feelin women
Post Extras:
Norm'
Duke status
Reged: 01/31/03
Posts: 18698
Loc: Lovetron
Quote: Are the people in my generation going to continue to harbor unfounded ill-will towards Middle Eastern countries like how Boomers feel about Russia and The Greatest Generation feels about Germany and Japan?
Indoctrination is a bitch
When will it be unfounded? I can't wait.
-------------------- "I mean, it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel."
Post Extras:
ifallalot
Duke status
Reged: 12/17/08
Posts: 17983
Loc: Carlsbad, CA
Quote: russian trains are plentiful and always packed. the subway system in moscow and st. petersburg makes new york's look like a slow moving sh!thole...well, not hard to do. but it's been in their culture for a long time. most people just don't have cars.
here tho...meh.. people love their cars. austin finally finished their train, after i guess about 10 years. it's only like three cars and they recently put mirror tint on the windows so people can't see how empty it is.
a shame...i'd use it, but i don't live in the 'burbs.
i'd love a train to the coast though. i'd be the worst nightmare...a weekend train warrior!
Weekend warrior! here we come! you and me Urch, I'll spot us the rental when we get to LaLa.
F*ck Russia...if the USA made schit cars like these, we'd all be on the rail too
Surfers endorsing cattlecars, sheeesh.
wow. Are you seriously that stupid? or is all that rain seeping into your brain? my reference to "coast" does not mean l.a. and as for those pics..well, i guess you really are an idiot.
my congratulations, mr. east texas wanna be redneck dumbass. that's a mighty fine argument you brought to the table.
Post Extras:
ratfink
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 07/15/08
Posts: 6441
Loc: Texas Gulf de Mexico
wow. Are you seriously that stupid? or is all that rain seeping into your brain? my reference to "coast" does not mean l.a. and as for those pics..well, i guess you really are an idiot.
my congratulations, mr. east texas wanna be redneck dumbass. that's a mighty fine argument you brought to the table.
What crawled up your azz? I referenced the lightrail proposed for LA-Las Vegas and San Francisco...hence LaLa as the hub.
PS, I don't live in East Texas. I currently live in an area that goes back 4 generations for me, hardly a "wannabe-redneck". And the rain, thank you, is a most welcome blessing to the farmers and ranchers who put the food on your ungrateful table.
I included you in a friendly and comic gesture with pics of cars from the Eastern Bloc. I guess my effort to have some fun with you was a mistake.
Have a nice day...
Post Extras:
GDaddy
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 01/16/06
Posts: 7135
Loc: Carlsbad
I don't get what you're talking about still, although I do feel that the Flyover States pose a bigger threat to my desired way of life than anyone overseas
Kinda ironic when considering the fact that the urban areas need the support provided by the flyover areas a lot more than the other way around. There's no such thing as a service based economy.
Post Extras:
Steak
Kelly Slater status
Reged: 11/09/10
Posts: 8185
Loc: No Country for Old Men
Quote: How will a bullet train from LAX to SAC facilitate commerce?
Where do you think the $68 billion or whatever this thing is going to cost is gonna go? Jerry Brown's pockets?
How about the contractors who win the bid? Who knows maybe Halliburton will be one of them.
How about the thousands that will be employed in this construction? They'll be spending their hard earned money? Yeah I know they'll be pesky union workers. Shucks.
How about the manufacturers that produce the parts and materials that go into this? Those that supply the rebar and cement for structures along the way.
How about the quarries that'll supply the gravel for the bedding of the tracks over hundreds of miles?
How about the electric company that provides the power to these trains?
How about the trucking companies that are hired to bring in all these materials?
How about the fuel companies that will provide the fuel for the heavy equipment used to build this line?
How about the staff that's employed to run this thing once it's up and running?
How about the companies that are doing concessions on these trains and in the stations?
How about the companies that will be profiting off of parking at stations?
How about the guy who opens up a hot dog stand right next to the new station?
I can keep going. Surely we can't count on every penny staying in state or even in country but the majority will. This thing is going to go on for a long time and a lot of money will be spent. But it's not going to just disappear. Yes this thing should ultimately be cost effective but keep in mind it's here to service us not profit off us. There's a lot of things in this world that simply aren't cost effective enough for private investors to tackle. Things where the potential for payback is too far down the line for the liking of most investors. Think about the interstate system. If we didn't have one would you think it'd be a good investment for a private corporation to build one? A project that takes ten plus years, costs billions and brings in nothing? No investor in their right mind would put their money into that. Which is why we have this little thing called government.
Out of State contractors will win the bids.
China will make everything else.
-------------------- If it doesn't have tits, fins, sparkplugs, gunpowder or hops I'm not interested.
Post Extras:
ifallalot
Duke status
Reged: 12/17/08
Posts: 17983
Loc: Carlsbad, CA
I don't get what you're talking about still, although I do feel that the Flyover States pose a bigger threat to my desired way of life than anyone overseas
Kinda ironic when considering the fact that the urban areas need the support provided by the flyover areas a lot more than the other way around. There's no such thing as a service based economy.
I repeat that there is no such thing as a service based economy ad nauseum. Here's the problem with the Flyover States
1. A political party with ulterior motives gets them fired up over social issues and lies that a pure free market will bring their jobs back. The political party then takes the power granted by their votes to give absolute freedom to the companies that employ them
2. Now that the companies have absolute freedom they are blinded by profit and move the flyover states' people's jobs overseas. Their favored political party says they have lost their jobs because the other political party has allowed regulation to hurt the company's bottom line. Now the taxes they still pay are given to people who look different than them. When the economic lies are too transparent for them to believe, favored political party throws up social issues to get them fired up about. Still no jobs.
3. In hope of a better economic life and and better climate, flyover state children move to our states, bringing their views which throw off the political, and more importantly, social culture of our state. They also take jobs away from natives and make our already crowded state more crowded.
-------------------- The only two things in life that make it worth livin is guitars tuned good and firm feelin women
Post Extras:
Norm'
Duke status
Reged: 01/31/03
Posts: 18698
Loc: Lovetron
Amtrak's Downeaster sets another ridership record Ridership grew 4 percent in the fiscal 2012, and ticket revenue grew by 4.5 percent.
PORTLAND — Amtrak's Downeaster set another ridership record, completing its fiscal year with 528,292 passengers, the highest in its 10-year history, officials said today.
Ridership figures for the fiscal year that ended June 30 represent the seventh consecutive year of growth, the Northern New England Passenger Rail Authority said. Ridership grew 4 percent in the fiscal 2012, and ticket revenue grew by 4.5 percent, the authority said.
The trend tracks with growing ridership overall for Amtrak, which has set records in eight of the last nine years and topped 30 million passengers for the first time last year.
The Northern New England Passenger Rail Authority, which operates the Downeaster, says it cannot pinpoint any single factor for the ridership increase. But it says surveys indicate there are more repeat customers.
"The economy comes and goes. Gas prices come and go. But we continue to gain a little bit every year," Patricia Quinn, the authority's executive director, said Tuesday. "It shows that more people are getting used to the service and more people are riding it more often."
The Downeaster makes five daily trips between Portland and Boston.
Later this year, two of those daily round-trips will extend northward to Freeport and Brunswick. That will mean even more passengers with projections for an additional 36,000 riders each year, as well as another 50,000 passengers down the road when the service further expands, Quinn said.
-------------------- "I mean, it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel."
Post Extras:
Norm'
Duke status
Reged: 01/31/03
Posts: 18698
Loc: Lovetron
So, you're a fan of countries that treat their own people like crap? Execute women for adultery. Stone people to death. Allow women to be raped or splashed with acid. Destroy historical artifacts, because they somehow see them as an affront.
Not me.
-------------------- "I mean, it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel."
Post Extras:
urchin
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 10/20/04
Posts: 2135
Quote: russian trains are plentiful and always packed. the subway system in moscow and st. petersburg makes new york's look like a slow moving sh!thole...well, not hard to do. but it's been in their culture for a long time. most people just don't have cars.
here tho...meh.. people love their cars. austin finally finished their train, after i guess about 10 years. it's only like three cars and they recently put mirror tint on the windows so people can't see how empty it is.
a shame...i'd use it, but i don't live in the 'burbs.
i'd love a train to the coast though. i'd be the worst nightmare...a weekend train warrior!
Weekend warrior! here we come! you and me Urch, I'll spot us the rental when we get to LaLa.
F*ck Russia...if the USA made schit cars like these, we'd all be on the rail too
Surfers endorsing cattlecars, sheeesh.
Quote:
Quote:
wow. Are you seriously that stupid? or is all that rain seeping into your brain? my reference to "coast" does not mean l.a. and as for those pics..well, i guess you really are an idiot.
my congratulations, mr. east texas wanna be redneck dumbass. that's a mighty fine argument you brought to the table.
What crawled up your azz? I referenced the lightrail proposed for LA-Las Vegas and San Francisco...hence LaLa as the hub.
PS, I don't live in East Texas. I currently live in an area that goes back 4 generations for me, hardly a "wannabe-redneck". And the rain, thank you, is a most welcome blessing to the farmers and ranchers who put the food on your ungrateful table.
I included you in a friendly and comic gesture with pics of cars from the Eastern Bloc. I guess my effort to have some fun with you was a mistake.
Have a nice day...
there is nothing funny about your post at all. it consists of hatred, ignorance and ridicule.
Quote: 3. In hope of a better economic life and and better climate, flyover state children move to our states, bringing their views which throw off the political, and more importantly, social culture of our state. They also take jobs away from natives and make our already crowded state more crowded.
You have outdown yourself with this one. For realz.
Here's some history for you.
-------------------- "That's their respect for me... I got leid," Rabbit Kekai
Post Extras:
ifallalot
Duke status
Reged: 12/17/08
Posts: 17983
Loc: Carlsbad, CA
Quote: 3. In hope of a better economic life and and better climate, flyover state children move to our states, bringing their views which throw off the political, and more importantly, social culture of our state. They also take jobs away from natives and make our already crowded state more crowded.
You have outdown yourself with this one. For realz.
Here's some history for you.
How come that argument is OK when applied to foreign immigrants?
-------------------- The only two things in life that make it worth livin is guitars tuned good and firm feelin women
Post Extras:
ifallalot
Duke status
Reged: 12/17/08
Posts: 17983
Loc: Carlsbad, CA
So, you're a fan of countries that treat their own people like crap? Execute women for adultery. Stone people to death. Allow women to be raped or splashed with acid. Destroy historical artifacts, because they somehow see them as an affront.
Not me.
Our country treats its people like crap too. Time to stop illustrating all of the reprehensible things done in other countries while turning a blind eye to our own.
Its time to realize that for every good action done by a human there is something horrifying done by another. There is no such thing as one culture's exceptionalism over another's.
-------------------- The only two things in life that make it worth livin is guitars tuned good and firm feelin women
Quote: 3. In hope of a better economic life and and better climate, flyover state children move to our states, bringing their views which throw off the political, and more importantly, social culture of our state. They also take jobs away from natives and make our already crowded state more crowded.
You have outdown yourself with this one. For realz.
So, you're a fan of countries that treat their own people like crap? Execute women for adultery. Stone people to death. Allow women to be raped or splashed with acid. Destroy historical artifacts, because they somehow see them as an affront.
Not me.
Our country treats its people like crap too. Time to stop illustrating all of the reprehensible things done in other countries while turning a blind eye to our own.
Its time to realize that for every good action done by a human there is something horrifying done by another. There is no such thing as one culture's exceptionalism over another's.
Oh please...
-------------------- "I mean, it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel."
So, you're a fan of countries that treat their own people like crap? Execute women for adultery. Stone people to death. Allow women to be raped or splashed with acid. Destroy historical artifacts, because they somehow see them as an affront.
Not me.
Our country treats its people like crap too. Time to stop illustrating all of the reprehensible things done in other countries while turning a blind eye to our own.
Its time to realize that for every good action done by a human there is something horrifying done by another. There is no such thing as one culture's exceptionalism over another's.
It's really pretty amazing how that works. Kinda like the Vladimir Putin man-crush half the erBB has.
-------------------- "[Rush] doesn't influence me either - merely reinforces what I already know" - 23rdstMB
All you mor@ns got it all wrong this is about land barron plays in Fresno and Bakersfield while the land is cheap.
Moonbeam say this will create 450,000 permanent "jobs." I call bvllsh!t no one is going to waste their opportunity cost riding this train when they can pay to fly Southwest and be there in 1 hour.
Post Extras:
GDaddy
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 01/16/06
Posts: 7135
Loc: Carlsbad
I think the "nobody" reference is a gross understatement. People will use the line if it's there, just like the people who ride the Coaster from SD to points north. I just question whether the number of users will ever justify the cost.
We already have segments of our population whose reproductive rates have declined to less-than-replacement levels. That's happening elsewhere among the industrialized nations, too. Certain parts of Europe are already grappling with the prospect of declining population.
We can depend on foreign immigration for our population growth in the short term but how long will the surplus in their reproductive rates continue? I mean, taken to its logical conclusion these trends will eventually extend through these various cultural groups - it's just a matter of time.
And as we've been discussing, employment follows opportunity, not weather. Advances in technology may eventually render obsolete certain business models requiring onsite workers. The implications of that prospect are profound. If you want to see an example of what that looks like you need look no further than the Rustbelt states of Michigan, Ohio and Indiana and such. Cities can and do depopulate when their dominant employment goes bust or leaves town.
So I question the assumption that the entire west coast will end up looking like the 19th century densities of the industrialized Northeast. I question the assumption that the freeways through these areas will become so gridlocked that a rail trip will save the traveler all that much time after including the time spent on the connections at either end.
BTW, apart from the Sierras, California also lacks the inclement weather conditions that routinely occur throughout the Northeast and which can also create additional challenges in all forms of travel other than rail.
If we're going to create more make-work employment and divert more private spending to public spending I think we'd get more bang for out buck by improving the local infrastructures, which at present are being starved to death.
Post Extras:
Q_Surf
Tom Curren status
Reged: 05/05/03
Posts: 14410
Loc: world's largest oregon
frvcvs has got nothing to base his supposed ridership counts on this dream train.
He's basically saying "build it and they will come".
The Train of Dreams. Build it and it will miraculously pay for itself.
Who cares if hardly anyone uses it. It will create some government funded jobs for a few years, and some conductors can oversee some mostly empty cars, for what will probably be a $100+ billion project, if it ever finishes.
And like others have mentioned. The majority of the cost is completely UNFUNDED. There's a $3 billion seed fund from the feds that will need to be paid back once the first piece of rail or spike get driven in the ground. The dems in Sacmo are foaming at the mouth for any $$$$ at this point, and I see them squandered before they even lay one piece of track in the cornfields between Bakersfield and Merced.
Yes, lets build it and enormous ridership will just............appear.
-------------------- did you surf today?
Post Extras:
Q_Surf
Tom Curren status
Reged: 05/05/03
Posts: 14410
Loc: world's largest oregon
Quote: frvcvs has got nothing to base his supposed ridership counts on this dream train.
He's basically saying "build it and they will come".
The Train of Dreams. Build it and it will miraculously pay for itself.
Who cares if hardly anyone uses it. It will create some government funded jobs for a few years, and some conductors can oversee some mostly empty cars, for what will probably be a $100+ billion project, if it ever finishes.
And like others have mentioned. The majority of the cost is completely UNFUNDED. There's a $3 billion seed fund from the feds that will need to be paid back once the first piece of rail or spike get driven in the ground. The dems in Sacmo are foaming at the mouth for any $$$$ at this point, and I see them squandered before they even lay one piece of track in the cornfields between Bakersfield and Merced.
Yes, lets build it and enormous ridership will just............appear.
I'm pretty sure I never made a claim about ridership counts. Did I? I never said enormous ridership will be pounding the pavement to ride this line the day the first train makes it's maiden voyage. We are a nation that's pretty set in our ways it's gonna take some time for anything new like this to catch on. I'm sure all you naysayers will be waiting eagerly a month after this thing starts running to say "Only XXXXXXXXX amount of people are riding this thing. It's a collosal failure, I told you so!!! " But that's expected from a shortsighted fool like you.
We spent almost a trillion dollars in iraq for what exactly? What did we get out of that besides more physical therapists, prosthetic specialists and shrinks employed by the VA? You didn't seem to have a problem with that spending.
Frankly I'd rather spend a hundred billion here employing people and investing in our infrastructure and take that chance. You seem to forget that the gov't isn't a business. It's not supposed to be run like a business. It's here to serve us not profit off of us. As I said earlier look at something like the interstate system. It's something we all use and clearly you think it's the best option. But when it was first proposed as a massive endeavor with a cost of hundreds of billions that took 35yrs to complete your attitude would see it as an investment with no immediate return and you'd certainly poo poo it. That's what gov't gives us and thats why we can't think of gov't like a business and we can't trust businesses to serve us the way the government does.
And for those of you who say we shouldn't look to other nations for influence when it comes to transit Dwight Eisenhower's support for the interstate system stemmed from his appreciation of the german audobahn.
-------------------- "[Rush] doesn't influence me either - merely reinforces what I already know" - 23rdstMB
Post Extras:
Steak
Kelly Slater status
Reged: 11/09/10
Posts: 8185
Loc: No Country for Old Men
Previous
Index
Next
Threaded
Edit
Reply
Quote
" But that's expected from a shortsighted fool like you.