NineNorth78W
Legend (inyourownmind)
Reged: 05/15/05
Posts: 345
Loc: CZ
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Bonzer Qs:
1) how different from thruster?
2) optimal for what conditions?
3) what other pros/cons?
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Doug93003
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 2138
Loc: Ventura
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Quote:
Bonzer Qs:
1) how different from thruster?
2) optimal for what conditions?
3) what other pros/cons?
My first Bonzer is probably being shaped right now so my opinion is limited to the few that I've borrowed.
The thruster fin configuration has it's limitations just like every fin system does. Modern day performance surfing is due not only to the talent of todays professionals but to the limitations of the design. Tail slides, reverse re-entrys, rail to rail surfing are all due to the limitations of the design.
As far as the performance of the board goes that is due more to the design of the board, thickness, outling, rocker, rails etc. then to the Bonzer fin config and bottom. You can design an all around board, gun, or small wave high performance board. You can change the center fin size and location to suit the waves you're riding. Not sure if anyone has tried a flexible fin with a Bonzer yet but I think it could work.
ANyway from my limited expierence the move to a modern shape bonzer from a thruster wasn't earth shattering. It felt similiar in a lot of ways. WHere the Bonzer was different was off the bottom turn and through cutbacks. It really kept it's speed. Also you didn't need to go rail to rail. Once you pick a line the board accelerates and really holds it's speed. I think this is where the 5th gear thing comes in. It feels like you're going faster then you normally do. I think this is due more to just going fast without all the work then it is to actually going faster. It has this feeling of being locked into the wave but definetly not stiff or tracky.
Another thing I noticed was that the board was pretty forgiving. The sweetspot on these boards is much bigger then on a modern thruster. You don't really need to be heavy on the back foot to change directions but if you are it's ok also. I think this again may have a lot to do with board design. The boards i tried were both squash tails and that little bit of extra volume in the tail lets you put a little more weight back there. Good for back side surfing.
All in all I don't think any fin design is superior to another. I think they all have their place. I think the thruster is probably more in tune with an advanced level of surfer while the Bonzer can be pushed just as far but is a better board for the intermediate surfer to really feel whats happening. I love quads as well and look to be adding one in the near future.
Best bet is to try and find one to ride. WHat you do get with a Cambell Brothers bonzer is excellent craftsmanship. As far as shapers go Malcolm is as good as it gets. He probably could have made a fortune shaping thousands of Thrusters a year and giving them away to pro surfers.
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I've been told many times on this BB that fins drag so i am no longer using them. -Greg Griffin
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vespagetti
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 3323
Loc: O - Side
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I'm fairly new to bonzers. The first ride on my Pavel 5 fin was kind of disappointing. I was cursing myself for even thinking that this board is for me. Then it happened. 4th wave of the session, it engaged the 5th gear and suddenly I was flying around sections and down the line like never before. The faster it went, more it accelerated with every turn. Once I got used to looking further down the line at the target rather then staying in the pocket at all times like on my thruster, things changed and this is my #1 board right now when the surf gets good. No pumping for speed ever, turn in long arcs, keep the high line and you will get to the parts of the wave you never thought are surfable. Having said all that I still like riding thrusters, in fact riding a thruster is much more fun after you rode one of these. 
Very thin rails, 6'6" and 20"3/4 wide
It goes even better since Pinliner pointed out that larger side fins should be in the back.   Thanks Peter.
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NineNorth78W
Legend (inyourownmind)
Reged: 05/15/05
Posts: 345
Loc: CZ
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Thanks for the info - sounds good. Vespagetti- nice shape on that board.
Rgds,
Jason
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Doug93003
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 2138
Loc: Ventura
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Quote:
Thanks for the info - sounds good. Vespagetti- nice shape on that board.
Rgds,
Jason
I would say the best thing you could do is ask LeeD. Currently he only surfs once or twice a year and is riding a plastic Bic Twin with the fins set dead straight. He's a Bonzer expert among other things.
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I've been told many times on this BB that fins drag so i am no longer using them. -Greg Griffin
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NineNorth78W
Legend (inyourownmind)
Reged: 05/15/05
Posts: 345
Loc: CZ
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By the way - what is "Bic"? I hear it all the time - don't have a clue what it is.
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Doug93003
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 2138
Loc: Ventura
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It's kinda like a plastic penis except......well yes, it's just like a plastic penis.
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I've been told many times on this BB that fins drag so i am no longer using them. -Greg Griffin
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vespagetti
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 3323
Loc: O - Side
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Quote:
By the way - what is "Bic"? I hear it all the time - don't have a clue what it is.
It's a French curse on the world of surfing. Oh, they also make pens and razors. 
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lob
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 02/20/03
Posts: 1917
Loc: bordeaux / France
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Quote:
By the way - what is "Bic"? I hear it all the time - don't have a clue what it is.
Being french and loving real surfboards, making som myself, I dare to answer.
Bic is an brand that produces pens and razors.
Once, they decided to start producing cheap surfboards they could sell to surfschool.
They asked Gerard Dabadie (a good french 8'or 9' shaper) to create the master shape and he did a poor job.
The thing really went very fast and strong and keeps on going.
Bic surfboards are made with two halves of molded plastic.
It's bulletproof but really uggly looking.
It surfs like sh.it and wheigth twice as much as a classic board.
A lot of people buy those "things" as a first ever board as they are cheap (half the price of a classic board) and never die... so they can sell them almost the price they payed for.
Well, bic are:
plastic pop outs.
sh.it shapes.
Poor construction.
Low price.
I hate those stuffs.
If only bic could disapear, I would'nt cry for a second.
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www.barrelsurfboards.com
www.barrelsurfboards.blogspot.com
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NineNorth78W
Legend (inyourownmind)
Reged: 05/15/05
Posts: 345
Loc: CZ
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he - that's pretty funny. When I first saw the term "Bic", I was thinking "pen? No can't be."
That's gonna have to go in Matt Warshaw's 2nd edition of The Encyclopedia of Surfing"
So like you're seeing these boards in the States now?
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blakestah
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 09/10/02
Posts: 6133
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Bonzers are an interesting design. The rail fins generate lift, and this is noticeable on powerful enough waves coming through a bottom turn. The lift generates a lot of speed - the trade-off is a reduced radius of turn. If you wanted vertical surfing I'd say use a thruster, or get a shorter bonzer. If you want to carry more speed through larger radius bottom turns...bonzer for sure.
Bonzers turn about the mid-point of the board - the big fin - it is always engaged. They do not change their turning pivot from rail to rail. You always work the turns off the center fin.
You can pump on the bonzer for speed, but it is done differently from a thruster. There's sort of a sweet spot between working the rail and center fin. Bonzers require a heavy rear foot.
If I had a lot of fast sections to make, so that slowing down by making a lot of short radius turns was impossible, I'd use a bonzer for sure. You can make a LOT of sections on a bonzer that would be hard/impossible on other boards.
There's also a bonzer mafioso on this BB, so you can expect heavy flames in the aftermath of this post. I made an effort to borrow a friend's bonzer last fall and rode it a bunch of times, and I do fin design work. Yesterday, made two new prototype fins for my thruster...
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SurfingLamb
Rabbitt Bartholomew status
Reged: 06/29/04
Posts: 9163
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In my opinion, the bonzer is different from the thruster in that you HAVE to get the right size for you. Being overgunned on a bonzer is totally different then being overgunned on a thruster, and the bonzer simply wont work. Case in point, on the 7'1" I had - it just wouldnt work. How life goes I guess.
Aloha
Bryan
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http://bryansbarrelhunter.blogspot.com/
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TRI FINS ARE DANGEROUS
Tom Curren status
Reged: 01/10/02
Posts: 12460
Loc: Pavement, CA USA
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Bonzer Hotline 760-891-0919
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Surfboard Blog: Surfy Surfy
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offroute
Legend (inyourownmind)
Reged: 02/20/04
Posts: 491
Loc: San Clemente
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Thanks for the info Blakestah. Converting over a CI single to 5 finner and curious to see how it will perform. Had the CI for almost 2 years, so it is going to be interesting riding it with a new fin configuration.
Question. You said the sides fin create lift which then generate speed, so when the board is at full plane is this the magic 5th gear that people often refer to?
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GWS
Duke status
Reged: 01/11/02
Posts: 24852
Loc: Oxtura
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Quote:
In my opinion, the bonzer is different from the thruster in that you HAVE to get the right size for you. Being overgunned on a bonzer is totally different then being overgunned on a thruster, and the bonzer simply wont work. Case in point, on the 7'1" I had - it just wouldnt work. How life goes I guess.
Aloha
Bryan
Bryan, I meant to say something about that board, but decided to let it ride. Here's a picture of your stick...
That center fin is not a Malcolm Campbell design. There is a ton of rake in that fin. Also, I know sometimes these little digital pictures make things look kind of goofy, but it appears that your side fins are quite a ways from the rail. For comparison...
Edited by GWS (05/27/05 08:36 AM)
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blakestah
Phil Edwards status
Reged: 09/10/02
Posts: 6133
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Quote:
Thanks for the info Blakestah. Converting over a CI single to 5 finner and curious to see how it will perform. Had the CI for almost 2 years, so it is going to be interesting riding it with a new fin configuration.
Question. You said the sides fin create lift which then generate speed, so when the board is at full plane is this the magic 5th gear that people often refer to?
Yup, the magnitude of the effect surprised me, even after reading about it.
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vespagetti
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 3323
Loc: O - Side
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Quote:
Not to be a smart ass or anything but it looks like something funky is going on with that tail and those fins. It looks like it's not just the length that didn't make it work. Just a feeling you get when you see a board like that that tells you: this board no worky. Not scientific I know, just a feeling. 
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vespagetti
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 3323
Loc: O - Side
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Quote:
If I had a lot of fast sections to make, so that slowing down by making a lot of short radius turns was impossible, I'd use a bonzer for sure. You can make a LOT of sections on a bonzer that would be hard/impossible on other boards.
That pretty much describes Oceanside surf. It's the exact feeling I had after riding a bonzer. Don't aim 10 feet ahead, look 50 feet down the line. Yes, behind those two crumbling sections.
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SurfingLamb
Rabbitt Bartholomew status
Reged: 06/29/04
Posts: 9163
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Yeah the board definately doesnt work, and is a totally different experience from the 6'4" Campbell ive ridden before.
From what I understand its a different design from the standard bonzer - and shines in the bigger surf, not really a board for anything I'll see in SoCal.
aloha
Bryan
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http://bryansbarrelhunter.blogspot.com/
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NineNorth78W
Legend (inyourownmind)
Reged: 05/15/05
Posts: 345
Loc: CZ
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by the way, what are bonzers running for these days ($) ??
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Doug93003
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 2138
Loc: Ventura
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Quote:
Yeah the board definately doesnt work, and is a totally different experience from the 6'4" Campbell ive ridden before.
From what I understand its a different design from the standard bonzer - and shines in the bigger surf, not really a board for anything I'll see in SoCal.
aloha
Bryan
Here's another picture of a Cambel Brothers EB5. You can really see the difference in the tail.
If you compare it with your board you can see the difference in the rail and tail design, fin placement, and cant.
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I've been told many times on this BB that fins drag so i am no longer using them. -Greg Griffin
Edited by Doug93003 (05/31/05 03:42 PM)
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Doug93003
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 07/08/03
Posts: 2138
Loc: Ventura
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About $485-500 add $$$ for color and custom finish.
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I've been told many times on this BB that fins drag so i am no longer using them. -Greg Griffin
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Kalani..
Michael Peterson status
Reged: 11/28/03
Posts: 2103
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Quote:
There's also a bonzer mafioso on this BB, so you can expect heavy flames in the aftermath of this post. I made an effort to borrow a friend's bonzer last fall and rode it a bunch of times, and I do fin design work. Yesterday, made two new prototype fins for my thruster...
I think that now that you have ridden one and given it a fair chance, you are entitled to say whatever you want about it. I'll never give you crap about that subject again... 
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www.psnwsurf.com
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